Comments on: Blind (and Incompetent) Justice Thanks to Spreadsheet? http://timoelliott.com/blog/2009/10/blind-and-incompetent-justice-thanks-to-spreadsheet.html Timo Elliott's Business Analytics Blog Fri, 18 May 2012 09:07:53 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Edward Miller http://timoelliott.com/blog/2009/10/blind-and-incompetent-justice-thanks-to-spreadsheet.html/comment-page-1#comment-3916 Edward Miller Sat, 24 Oct 2009 19:39:41 +0000 http://timoelliott.com/blog/?p=1300#comment-3916 Glad I don't live in Maryland anymore. I don't know what Delaware, my home for 37 years uses but I have seen friends and family ground up in the criminal injustice system. My grandson, 21, studied criminal justice and became sickened at how it really works. If you have the money, you get a good lawyer who gets you off or makes a sweetheart deal. If you ha ve a public defender, he assumes you're guilty and trys to make a deal. If you go to trial, hope you don't get certain judges. At last, that's how it works in Sussex County where I live. Get a ticket, get it switched to court of common pleas and make a deal with the DA at a reduced charge. Justice is not blind, humans make mistakes, and money is a BIG part of justice. Sad, isn't it? Glad I don’t live in Maryland anymore. I don’t know what Delaware, my home for 37 years uses but I have seen friends and family ground up in the criminal injustice system. My grandson, 21, studied criminal justice and became sickened at how it really works. If you have the money, you get a good lawyer who gets you off or makes a sweetheart deal. If you ha ve a public defender, he assumes you’re guilty and trys to make a deal. If you go to trial, hope you don’t get certain judges. At last, that’s how it works in Sussex County where I live. Get a ticket, get it switched to court of common pleas and make a deal with the DA at a reduced charge. Justice is not blind, humans make mistakes, and money is a BIG part of justice. Sad, isn’t it?

]]> By: Oncelost http://timoelliott.com/blog/2009/10/blind-and-incompetent-justice-thanks-to-spreadsheet.html/comment-page-1#comment-3913 Oncelost Sat, 24 Oct 2009 04:00:09 +0000 http://timoelliott.com/blog/?p=1300#comment-3913 Laws are written not by scientist or engineers but by humanity subject based degrees. These lawyers never tell the crime and punishment in a clear concise way. Example: unintended kick - punishment 4 lashes. etc. The legal profession wants its rewards no matter how absurd is the law. Laws are written not by scientist or engineers but by humanity subject based degrees. These lawyers never tell the crime and punishment in a clear concise way. Example: unintended kick – punishment 4 lashes. etc. The legal profession wants its rewards no matter how absurd is the law.

]]> By: Erigami http://timoelliott.com/blog/2009/10/blind-and-incompetent-justice-thanks-to-spreadsheet.html/comment-page-1#comment-3909 Erigami Fri, 23 Oct 2009 21:25:35 +0000 http://timoelliott.com/blog/?p=1300#comment-3909 Mike: Read the article. I quote: <blockquote>The work sheet had to be filled out by the state attorney prosecuting the case, with the final form signed and approved by the defense attorney (who, if he was doing his job properly, would have done the work sheet calculations independently). The commission had, by design, handed off the task of work sheet completion to parties that it assumed would have every incentive to get the numbers right, but it apparently never accounted for widespread incompetence in Maryland's legal profession.</blockquote> There is an adversarial system. The defense attorneys failed to correct the mistakes make by the prosecutors. e Mike: Read the article. I quote:

The work sheet had to be filled out by the state attorney prosecuting the case, with the final form signed and approved by the defense attorney (who, if he was doing his job properly, would have done the work sheet calculations independently). The commission had, by design, handed off the task of work sheet completion to parties that it assumed would have every incentive to get the numbers right, but it apparently never accounted for widespread incompetence in Maryland’s legal profession.

There is an adversarial system. The defense attorneys failed to correct the mistakes make by the prosecutors.

e

]]> By: Timo Elliott http://timoelliott.com/blog/2009/10/blind-and-incompetent-justice-thanks-to-spreadsheet.html/comment-page-1#comment-3907 Timo Elliott Fri, 23 Oct 2009 16:36:30 +0000 http://timoelliott.com/blog/?p=1300#comment-3907 Neat illustration, huh? But fixed it anyway... Neat illustration, huh? But fixed it anyway…

]]> By: Mike http://timoelliott.com/blog/2009/10/blind-and-incompetent-justice-thanks-to-spreadsheet.html/comment-page-1#comment-3906 Mike Fri, 23 Oct 2009 15:56:26 +0000 http://timoelliott.com/blog/?p=1300#comment-3906 "You can never overestimate the “information competency” of your users" Think about that one for a moment. You just again demonstrated how fallible human users actually are. "Build in checks and balances and collaboration" No, what you need to build in is an adversarial system. Give the worksheet to the convicted person, his lawyer, and the DA; they have opposing interests, yet they all need to come up with the same answer. “You can never overestimate the “information competency” of your users”

Think about that one for a moment. You just again demonstrated how fallible human users actually are.

“Build in checks and balances and collaboration”

No, what you need to build in is an adversarial system. Give the worksheet to the convicted person, his lawyer, and the DA; they have opposing interests, yet they all need to come up with the same answer.

]]> By: Dave King http://timoelliott.com/blog/2009/10/blind-and-incompetent-justice-thanks-to-spreadsheet.html/comment-page-1#comment-3905 Dave King Fri, 23 Oct 2009 14:30:33 +0000 http://timoelliott.com/blog/?p=1300#comment-3905 You can never overestimate the “information competency” of your users? Wouldn't that be underestimate? - Peace You can never overestimate the “information competency” of your users?

Wouldn’t that be underestimate?

- Peace

]]>